Need your help for a column - A State of Racing Survey of Sorts

[RaceNite]

Many local race tracks are suffering with fan counts at an all time low. The southeast is reportedly suffering and that could be because so many tracks are located so close to each other. The same can be said for the northeast!

But what about the midwest? The south? The southwest and northwest? Are tracks out there feeling the pinch?

Promoters have laid blame on high gas prices, poor economy, and the fact that ticket prices have to be high so they can afford to pay a high purse to the top division(s).

RPM's Stewart Doty said in this month's newsletter that it is time that race tracks "get back to the $8 tickets, $15 pit passes, modest purses, and economy, locally based racing ..."

This is where I need your help! I am writing a new column and you can help by answering a few questions in my little survey.

Question 1: First name, state, and whether you are a promoter, track employee, car owner, driver, crew, or fan

Question 2: In your opinion - is your local track(s) struggling to draw fans, cars, or both?

Question 3: In response to question 2 - why do you think that is?

Question 4: What is your tracks top class? Super Late Models, 410 Sprints, Modifieds, IMCA style Mods, etc ...

Question 5: $8 Tickets and $15 pit passes means you might see $700 to win for the top class ... Do you think Supers, 410's, Modifieds, and Late Model Stock Cars could afford to race for that?

Question 6: What is fair to pay your top class to win/start and what prices would you charge at the front gate and pit gate?

Question 7: What classes would you run and do you need anything different like school bus races, boat races, etc ... to draw fans in?

And finally ... Question 8: If two tracks with similiar classes were running friday night, four on Saturday night, one on Sunday night, and none on any other night of the week - which night would you think that you could be most successful?

I appreciate everyones efforts in answering these questions ... The column will appear in RPM Racing News in the next week or so and I wil post here as well.

Mark

[KevinF]

Well, here goes (just my opinions - for what they're worth, which probably isn't a whole lot!)...

Many local race tracks are suffering with fan counts at an all time low. The southeast is reportedly suffering and that could be because so many tracks are located so close to each other. The same can be said for the northeast!

True, but more population and better economy in Northeast

But what about the midwest? The south? The southwest and northwest? Are tracks out there feeling the pinch?

Probably not as much - have been able to keep costs down better

Promoters have laid blame on high gas prices, poor economy, and the fact that ticket prices have to be high so they can afford to pay a high purse to the top division(s).

RPM's Stewart Doty said in this month's newsletter that it is time that race tracks "get back to the $8 tickets, $15 pit passes, modest purses, and economy, locally based racing ..."

This is where I need your help! I am writing a new column and you can help by answering a few questions in my little survey.

Question 1: First name, state, and whether you are a promoter, track employee, car owner, driver, crew, or fan

Kevin, NC, (track) photographer

Question 2: In your opinion - is your local track(s) struggling to draw fans, cars, or both?

Both!

Question 3: In response to question 2 - why do you think that is?

Too many tracks, too close together for population base and available money. Also, rules differ from track to track for most divisions.

Question 4: What is your tracks top class? Super Late Models, 410 Sprints, Modifieds, IMCA style Mods, etc ...

weekly - Thunder & Lightning (ie. Super Stock), special shows - Super Late Models

Question 5: $8 Tickets and $15 pit passes means you might see $700 to win for the top class ... Do you think Supers, 410's, Modifieds, and Late Model Stock Cars could afford to race for that?

No for those classes - not unless most of the teams have a lot more in sponsor dollars than they have now

Question 6: What is fair to pay your top class to win/start and what prices would you charge at the front gate and pit gate?

For Thunder & Lightning (Super Stock) as top class - $700/win, $75/start. $12 front gate, $20 pit gate

Question 7: What classes would you run and do you need anything different like school bus races, boat races, etc ... to draw fans in?

I'd run Limited Late Models as top class, then 2 V8 stock classes and 2 four cylinder classes. If you've got good regular classes (and some good touring divisions), you don't need to run gimmick stuff (although I would't be against it a couple of times a year)

And finally ... Question 8: If two tracks with similiar classes were running friday night, four on Saturday night, one on Sunday night, and none on any other night of the week - which night would you think that you could be most successful?

Around here, I'd say one of the Saturday night tracks. If the Sunday night track is close to a big population area (so most people would have a short drive), it potentially could be the most successful

I appreciate everyones efforts in answering these questions ... The column will appear in RPM Racing News in the next week or so and I wil post here as well.

Mark

[RaceNite]

Thanks for your reply Kevin ... hopefully others will follow suit

[L8models]

Question 1: First name, state, and whether you are a promoter, track employee, car owner, driver, crew, or fan

Jerry, Eastern North Carolina, Fan

Question 2: In your opinion - is your local track(s) struggling to draw fans, cars, or both?

4 out of the 5 tracks in my area are stuggling to draw both.

Question 3: In response to question 2 - why do you think that is?

5 dirt tracks too close together, Payout varies alot, Rules differ, fans follow their local driver and go where the SLM count is the highest, cost of living.

Question 4: What is your tracks top class? Super Late Models, 410 Sprints, Modifieds, IMCA style Mods, etc ...

Super Late Model

Question 5: $8 Tickets and $15 pit passes means you might see $700 to win for the top class ... Do you think Supers, 410's, Modifieds, and Late Model Stock Cars could afford to race for that?

No.

Question 6: What is fair to pay your top class to win/start and what prices would you charge at the front gate and pit gate?

Super Late Model (Top Class) $ 2,000 to win, $ 125 to start. $12/front gate, $20/pits

Question 7: What classes would you run and do you need anything different like school bus races, boat races, etc ... to draw fans in?

Super Late Models, purestock v8, Sportsman, Super Stock and 4 cylinder modifieds. I would also have a national touring series(Lucas Oil, WoO) atleat 3 times a year.


And finally ... Question 8: If two tracks with similiar classes were running friday night, four on Saturday night, one on Sunday night, and none on any other night of the week - which night would you think that you could be most successful?

I think the less tracks than run on a specific night will benefit better, hands down. Naturally, Saturday night is the ideal night that will attract more fans. Just as it is has proved in this area, Location is everthing. I am speaking on behalf of 5 local tracks in my general area. One of these tracks is in the "ideal" location and has proven to be successful in having high fan and car counts on a weekly basis.

[skinser11fan]

Question 1: First name, state, and whether you are a promoter, track employee, car owner, driver, crew, or fan

William, VA, Fan

Question 2: In your opinion - is your local track(s) struggling to draw fans, cars, or both?

Both

Question 3: In response to question 2 - why do you think that is?

In my area reason is lack of promotion, tracks too close together, slightly different rules so cars are not legal at other track, same night of operation.

Question 4: What is your tracks top class? Super Late Models, 410 Sprints, Modifieds, IMCA style Mods, etc ...

LMSC

Question 5: $8 Tickets and $15 pit passes means you might see $700 to win for the top class ... Do you think Supers, 410's, Modifieds, and Late Model Stock Cars could afford to race for that?

NO

Question 6: What is fair to pay your top class to win/start and what prices would you charge at the front gate and pit gate?

$1,000 to win, $50 to start, $10 front gate, $15 pits

Question 7: What classes would you run and do you need anything different like school bus races, boat races, etc ... to draw fans in?

LMSC, Limiteds and Street Stocks, a touring class twice a season. No more than 3 classes, to many classes mean low car counts per class and races that end too late.

And finally ... Question 8: If two tracks with similiar classes were running friday night, four on Saturday night, one on Sunday night, and none on any other night of the week - which night would you think that you could be most successful?

In my area both tracks 40 miles apart race Saturday night, I would cooperate on rules and classes and run 1 Fri and the other Sat. Wish we had a problem like you stated in question.

[Wilder4Racin]

Question 1: First name, state, and whether you are a promoter, track employee, car owner, driver, crew, or fan

Wilder, NC.... a fan and work with EMS at the track

Question 2: In your opinion - is your local track(s) struggling to draw fans, cars, or both?

both

Question 3: In response to question 2 - why do you think that is?

I think the track needs some improvements to bleachers, the schedule and stop all the fighting. It would be nice to see late models on a regular basis as the bleacher seem to reflect that is what they like.

Question 4: What is your tracks top class? Super Late Models, 410 Sprints, Modifieds, IMCA style Mods, etc ...
T&L

Question 5: $8 Tickets and $15 pit passes means you might see $700 to win for the top class ... Do you think Supers, 410's, Modifieds, and Late Model Stock Cars could afford to race for that?

if it wasnt so commercialized and if ppl would learn to race for fun and not for protests or what have ya.. then yes

Question 6: What is fair to pay your top class to win/start and what prices would you charge at the front gate and pit gate?

thats not for me to say

Question 7: What classes would you run and do you need anything different like school bus races, boat races, etc ... to draw fans in?

we live in a community that isnt rich, and most ppl live on a fixed income, so if there was a way to make different kind of races throughout the year without loosing the fans, I would say its a great idea.

And finally ... Question 8: If two tracks with similiar classes were running friday night, four on Saturday night, one on Sunday night, and none on any other night of the week - which night would you think that you could be most successful?

I think they need to get together and run the same rules for every track and have a points fund for both tracks. One track race on a Friday night, next race Saturday night and if feesable, race on a Sunday afternoon.
Just my opinion on this and appreciate the email asking me to do it!

[lucky_lady27870]

1) Lynn, Nc a car owner, driver and fan
2)fans
3)gas prices
4)super stock 4
5)NO
6)$20 to get in pits and $20 entry fee except top classes and they should pay $50 entry fee, $1000 to win 7) nothing 8) Sunday afternoon

[JAMES@CLR]

Many local race tracks are suffering with fan counts at an all time low. The southeast is reportedly suffering and that could be because so many tracks are located so close to each other. The same can be said for the northeast!

Too many tracks for the amount of cars and fans. There are no more tracks than there were 20 years ago , just not as many racing fans and race teams.

But what about the midwest? The south? The southwest and northwest? Are tracks out there feeling the pinch?

From the reports that I am getting it is all over the country , just worse in the southeast due to the economy.

Promoters have laid blame on high gas prices, poor economy, and the fact that ticket prices have to be high so they can afford to pay a high purse to the top division(s).

Gate fees have to go up to help pay for the increase in operating cost , just as any other business. If you go out to eat it cost more than it did 10 years ago , it is the same with operating a race track.

RPM's Stewart Doty said in this month's newsletter that it is time that race tracks "get back to the $8 tickets, $15 pit passes, modest purses, and economy, locally based racing ..."

We are locally based racing , but the teams still have high operating cost , therefore the purse needs to be respectable.

This is where I need your help! I am writing a new column and you can help by answering a few questions in my little survey.

Question 1: First name, state, and whether you are a promoter, track employee, car owner, driver, crew, or fan

James , North Carolina , I promote County Line Raceway

Question 2: In your opinion - is your local track(s) struggling to draw fans, cars, or both?

The attendance is 25% of what it was ten years ago. Car count is less than 50% of what is was ten years ago. Both need to improve.

Question 3: In response to question 2 - why do you think that is?

Economy. More other things for families to do for entertainment on the weekends. Not as many families are involved as there used to be.

Question 4: What is your tracks top class? Super Late Models, 410 Sprints, Modifieds, IMCA style Mods, etc ...

Late Model (Steel Head)

Question 5: $8 Tickets and $15 pit passes means you might see $700 to win for the top class ... Do you think Supers, 410's, Modifieds, and Late Model Stock Cars could afford to race for that?

Not with the cost of operating a race team being what it is today.

Question 6: What is fair to pay your top class to win/start and what prices would you charge at the front gate and pit gate?

Between $1000 and $1200 to win. Between $100 and $150 to start.
Front Gate $12 to $15 ..... Pit Gate $20 to $25

Question 7: What classes would you run and do you need anything different like school bus races, boat races, etc ... to draw fans in?

Pure Stock Four Cylinder , Super Stock Four Cylinder , Pure Stock V-8 , Super Stock V-8/Thunder & Lightning , Late Model , Kid's Class

And finally ... Question 8: If two tracks with similiar classes were running friday night, four on Saturday night, one on Sunday night, and none on any other night of the week - which night would you think that you could be most successful?

Saturday night

I appreciate everyones efforts in answering these questions ... The column will appear in RPM Racing News in the next week or so and I wil post here as well.

[tas]

Question 1: First name, state, and whether you are a promoter, track employee, car owner, driver, crew, or fan

Tyler, NC, track employee

Question 2: In your opinion - is your local track(s) struggling to draw fans, cars, or both?

both

Question 3: In response to question 2 - why do you think that is?

Tracks need to work together, locally there are at least 4 tracks running on
the same night within an hour to an hour and a half

Question 4: What is your tracks top class? Super Late Models, 410 Sprints, Modifieds, IMCA style Mods, etc ...

Thunder & Lightning

Question 5: $8 Tickets and $15 pit passes means you might see $700 to win for the top class ... Do you think Supers, 410's, Modifieds, and Late Model Stock Cars could afford to race for that?

No, we have a hard time drawing a good field of cars with what we offer

Question 6: What is fair to pay your top class to win/start and what prices would you charge at the front gate and pit gate?

T&L 750 front gate 12 pits 25

Question 7: What classes would you run and do you need anything different like school bus races, boat races, etc ... to draw fans in?

super stock 4, super stock v8, pure stock 4, pure stock v8, thunder & lightning, late models(maybe twice a month), touring series at least 2 times a year. we have tried some specials like that such as train races and demo derbys but did not have any cars to show up.

And finally ... Question 8: If two tracks with similiar classes were running friday night, four on Saturday night, one on Sunday night, and none on any other night of the week - which night would you think that you could be most successful?
here Saturday seems to be the most successful. other sports are big here and once they start you can really tell a big drop in the fan count.

[Frankie24]

Many local race tracks are suffering with fan counts at an all time low. The southeast is reportedly suffering and that could be because so many tracks are located so close to each other. The same can be said for the northeast!

But what about the midwest? The south? The southwest and northwest? Are tracks out there feeling the pinch?

Promoters have laid blame on high gas prices, poor economy, and the fact that ticket prices have to be high so they can afford to pay a high purse to the top division(s).

RPM's Stewart Doty said in this month's newsletter that it is time that race tracks "get back to the $8 tickets, $15 pit passes, modest purses, and economy, locally based racing ..."

This is where I need your help! I am writing a new column and you can help by answering a few questions in my little survey.

Question 1: First name, state, and whether you are a promoter, track employee, car owner, driver, crew, or fan
Frankie North Carolina , I'm a fan

Question 2: In your opinion - is your local track(s) struggling to draw fans, cars, or both?

Both
I think it might be in the staff at the track where the rules change to fit their needs.Just like there are certain drivers, they let get away with things where some couldn't.

Question 3: In response to question 2 - why do you think that is?
Well the other night I was at the this one track where one class was racing and the flagman black flagged this one car. The driver took along time getting off the track. but when he did get off the track the driver jumped into another one of their cars in a different class and got back on the track. Even if it was only a few laps to go they should have never let that happen. But thats where the kiss butt comes in. When there are dirvers they let run like they want to. I had a few words with the flagman that night and he only said he wasn't hurting anything.

Question 4: What is your tracks top class? Super Late Models, 410 Sprints, Modifieds, IMCA style Mods, etc ...
Late Model on occasional

Question 5: $8 Tickets and $15 pit passes means you might see $700 to win for the top class ... Do you think Supers, 410's, Modifieds, and Late Model Stock Cars could afford to race for that?

The track I go to charges $20.00 for pits & $10.00 for grandstand. Unless like this pasted weekend late models raced and they charged $25.00 for the pits and $15.00 for the grandstands. Why charge more when they show? I think if the price would stay the same more people would show.

Question 6: What is fair to pay your top class to win/start and what prices would you charge at the front gate and pit gate?

I would charge the same price all season even if the late models or sprint cars are there.Give the fans alittle something special for there money.

Question 7: What classes would you run and do you need anything different like school bus races, boat races, etc ... to draw fans in?

I like the stock four. I don't race but my son does.

And finally ... Question 8: If two tracks with similiar classes were running friday night, four on Saturday night, one on Sunday night, and none on any other night of the week - which night would you think that you could be most successful?

I would rather keep the race on a Friday or Saturday night so I can keep going to the Nascar race on Sunday when I go.

I appreciate everyones efforts in answering these questions ... The column will appear in RPM Racing News in the next week or so and I wil post here as well.

Mark

[TarheelofVa]

Question 1: First name, state, and whether you are a promoter, track employee, car owner, driver, crew, or fan
Lynette,Northern Virginia
I am a big time fan

Question 2: In your opinion - is your local track(s) struggling to draw fans, cars, or both?
Yes in fact my track has been struggling for a couple years now..So much in fact..they sold it and this year 2006 is the final season for "Old Dominion Speedway" Manassas Virginia
The fans slowly quit coming out on saturday nites..I myself think it mostly has to do with the price of tickets..Racing should be a family affair but if you can't afford to take your family then you stay home..And in return..Bleachers are empty.

Question 3: In response to question 2 - why do you think that is?
answer above


Question 4: What is your tracks top class? Super Late Models, 410 Sprints, Modifieds, IMCA style Mods, etc ...
Super Late Models

Question 5: $8 Tickets and $15 pit passes means you might see $700 to win for the top class ... Do you think Supers, 410's, Modifieds, and Late Model Stock Cars could afford to race for that?
Well its sorta like the egg before the chicken thing..Can they afford to let their cars sit in their car ports no raced after spending all those dollars to build them?After track closes its a little late to decide how cheap you are willing to race..

Question 6: What is fair to pay your top class to win/start and what prices would you charge at the front gate and pit gate?
I really don't have answers for this question..I just know that there has to be a way for racers to do what they love..Now I mean the racers that are out there because they love the sport of racing , not the ones out there trying to be a star and win big bucks..

Question 7: What classes would you run and do you need anything different like school bus races, boat races, etc ... to draw fans in?
Ha ! I personally would want to see any track go to that measure..lol But maybe better promoting of the track and a nicer gift shop with nice drivers stuff ? As for ODS They offered some stuff for sale.But not nice stuff..Ans as for promoting? There are people living right here in Woodbridge that have never heard of ODS until it got on the news that it was closing..Now thats about as sad as things can get..

And finally ... Question 8: If two tracks with similiar classes were running friday night, four on Saturday night, one on Sunday night, and none on any other night of the week - which night would you think that you could be most successful?
As a Track ?
Saturday nite
As a Driver ?
Saturday nite
Saturday nite is gonna be best nite to run any classes .And as far as fans being there also Saturday nite is gonna be their best bet.

[dirt_fan_58]

1. Andrew, SC, Fan

2. A little of both

3. Favortism from officals to certain drivers

4. Street Stock

5. What TarheelofVA said

6. I don't mind paying $10 dollars for a regular show in the stands then $20 for a big race. The only thing is that they need to give us a notice that the price will be raised before we get there and don't have enough money to get in and eat.

7. If they bring 604's back in crates then there willl be more racing in that division and it should bring more racing to Super Stock also whcih will draw a bunch more fans.

8. I would say Saturday Night.
Friday you will have to hurry home from work and get everything ready, then you will be late
Sunday you will have to hope you get out of there by a desent hour so you can get ready for bed and work on Monday

[jswigert]

Many local race tracks are suffering with fan counts at an all time low. The southeast is reportedly suffering and that could be because so many tracks are located so close to each other. The same can be said for the northeast!

My feeling is racing has become too expensive which drives a lot of potential car owners away. Racing is supposed to be a hobby and fun, all too often we get carried away and some well financed teams just throw tons of money into their car. This makes is very hard on low dollar teams, and because they are no where close to competitive they get out of racing. That is one reason why I think there are fewer cars. When I was racing in the sportsman class we had a $3500 car and were completive, try that today.
But what about the Midwest? The south? The southwest and northwest? Are tracks out there feeling the pinch?
I think all areas of the country are hurting, some more than others
Promoters have laid blame on high gas prices, poor economy, and the fact that ticket prices have to be high so they can afford to pay a high purse to the top division(s).
I feel they have some effect, as for purses they are not that much higher today than in the late 80's. Special events not included. Today’s purses do not reflect the increased cost of putting a car on the track. However if the purse increased according to inflation fans could not afford ticket prices. The cost of operating the track has to be considered also, their costs have gone up considerably over the years. Admission prices need to be affordable, but tracks need to amke money to improve their facilities.
RPM's Stewart Doty said in this month's newsletter that it is time that race tracks "get back to the $8 tickets, $15 pit passes, modest purses, and economy, locally based racing ..."
Good idea, but fans have become used to seeing Super late models and the like race and put on a good show. Rule standardization would help and make lower classes more affordable.
This is where I need your help! I am writing a new column and you can help by answering a few questions in my little survey.

Question 1
Joe, x-racer-- now fan, North Carolina
Question 2
Car counts down dramatically along with fans. I think one method to increase car counts is standardize rules amoung area tracks, engine rules need to be controlled, possibly “CRATE” engines, and maybe “CLAIM” rules to prevent a team for spending tremendous amounts of money on the engine. The upper classes should have more flexibility, but the stock V8 and lower classes need cost containment.
Question 3
The cost of building and operating a competive car. Again standardize rules among tracks, seal engines and inspect for tampering in lower classes. Make it more affordable for entry level teams to race, car counts will increase. The cost to enter the track also needs to be controlled (that is going to be the hardest-everyone want high purses, no one want high ticket prices)
Question 4
Late Model
Question 5
Not with today’s cost of operating a team. That purse will equal no cars or very few cars. Teams are going to where the money is.
Question 6
Not racing any more I don’t feel qualified to answer that question. But in my area Late model races that pay $2000-4000 to win have a good field of cars. As for gate and pit prices, the higher the purse the higher they will be. I understand that and will pay, however a family man would look at it much differently. It has to be high enough to be profitable, but not to high to drive fans away. Gate $12 to $20 for adult, pit $25 to $30. Possibly lower classes pay less for pit than upper classes????
Question 7
Pure stock classes ( 4 and 8) Super Stock (4 and 8), Sportsman/Super Street/Thunder & Lightening, Limited Late Model, Late Model. Possibly a junior class
Question 8
Saturday night seems best, but tracks might work together and alternate Limited Late Model one week Late Model other. Might get more cars. Might even alternate weeks one week on one week off between two tracks. Just my two cents.

[w1ck3d0n3l0st]

Question 1: First name, state, and whether you are a promoter, track employee, car owner, driver, crew, or fan: Walton Sullivan ,crew memeber

Question 2: In your opinion - is your local track(s) struggling to draw fans, cars, or both?both

Question 3: In response to question 2 - why do you think that is?prices of everything today and to many track in one lil area

Question 4: What is your tracks top class? Super Late Models, 410 Sprints, Modifieds, IMCA style Mods, etc ... Super Late Models

Question 5: $8 Tickets and $15 pit passes means you might see $700 to win for the top class ... Do you think Supers, 410's, Modifieds, and Late Model Stock Cars could afford to race for that? No way no today cost to much to run race cars today

Question 6: What is fair to pay your top class to win/start and what prices would you charge at the front gate and pit gate?50 to enter/100 to start 10 to get into the stand 15 for big races, 20 to get in pits 25 if big races

Question 7: What classes would you run and do you need anything different like school bus races, boat races, etc ... to draw fans in? try figure 8 racin

And finally ... Question 8: If two tracks with similiar classes were running friday night, four on Saturday night, one on Sunday night, and none on any other night of the week - which night would you think that you could be most successful? Saturday would be the one cause friday people are workin don't get off till 3or 4 most the time and sunday most people have church so Sarurday even do you have more track runnin

[ncrdbl1]

Question 1: First name, state, and whether you are a promoter, track employee, car owner, driver, crew, or fan

Rick Johnson, Memphis,tn Driver owner.

Question 2: In your opinion - is your local track(s) struggling to draw fans, cars, or both?

Yes and NO, We had two track before this year. The saturday night track (opened in 1949) drew fairly well. The friday night track had decent crowds, but was closed due to Corp decisions from the out of town ownership. The saturday night track was sold this year and the new owner tried to run both friday and saturday night. The friday night crowd was awful and the saturday night show suffered some due to poor track conditions created by trying to run both nights.

Question 3: In response to question 2 - why do you think that is?

Friday due to the fact the regular saturday night crowds did not care for what was on the friday night program and the crowd from the old friday night track didn't show up. The saturday night crowd began to drop due to poor track conditions cause by running two nights a week.

Question 4: What is your tracks top class? Super Late Models, 410 Sprints, Modifieds, IMCA style Mods, etc ...

360 sprints and Late models both $1200 to win.

Question 5: $8 Tickets and $15 pit passes means you might see $700 to win for the top class ... Do you think Supers, 410's, Modifieds, and Late Model Stock Cars could afford to race for that?

$700 to win is a good top prize for rural track who run maybe the mods for their top class. Not a good enough top payout for Late Models or Sprints.

Question 6: What is fair to pay your top class to win/start and what prices would you charge at the front gate and pit gate?

Sprints and latemodel close to large urban areas $1200 to $1500, Rural areas $700, no track should pay modifieds near the purse of Late Models or Sprints.

Question 7: What classes would you run and do you need anything different like school bus races, boat races, etc ... to draw fans in?

I enjoy our regular saturday night program of 360 sprints, Late Models, 305 sprints, stock cars, mini stocks and mini sprints, with maybe adding the modifieds of they will run for support class money. No need to have gimmick races if you can build strong affordable weekly classes where the competition is fair and rivalries are created with in each class.

And finally ... Question 8: If two tracks with similiar classes were running friday night, four on Saturday night, one on Sunday night, and none on any other night of the week - which night would you think that you could be most successful?

Saturday is historically race night in America. So that should be the most successful night. I believe the track which is more successful in creating a strong weekly program and focuses on the weekly program will be the most successful. Too many track want to take the easy way out and rely on specials to draw the crowds. Instead of creating a strong foundation of weekly events where the fans can relate to the local drivers on a personal basis. The specials route ends up hurting weekly programs as more and more track run them the bigger names that usually were track favorites are now going from track to track in search of the big pay day. The fans want to see these drivers each week and when it seems to them that the big names are no longer around fans find it easier to stay home. Fans need to know that their favorite or least favorite are going to be there each week.

[RacingMom15]

Many local race tracks are suffering with fan counts at an all time low. The southeast is reportedly suffering and that could be because so many tracks are located so close to each other. The same can be said for the northeast!

But what about the midwest? The south? The southwest and northwest? Are tracks out there feeling the pinch?

Promoters have laid blame on high gas prices, poor economy, and the fact that ticket prices have to be high so they can afford to pay a high purse to the top division(s).

RPM's Stewart Doty said in this month's newsletter that it is time that race tracks "get back to the $8 tickets, $15 pit passes, modest purses, and economy, locally based racing ..."

This is where I need your help! I am writing a new column and you can help by answering a few questions in my little survey.

Question 1: First name, state, and whether you are a promoter, track employee, car owner, driver, crew, or fan
Debra NC Fan

Question 2: In your opinion - is your local track(s) struggling to draw fans, cars, or both?
Both
Question 3: In response to question 2 - why do you think that is?
Ubknown
Question 4: What is your tracks top class? Super Late Models, 410 Sprints, Modifieds, IMCA style Mods, etc ...
Super Late Model

Question 5: $8 Tickets and $15 pit passes means you might see $700 to win for the top class ... Do you think Supers, 410's, Modifieds, and Late Model Stock Cars could afford to race for that? No Way

Question 6: What is fair to pay your top class to win/start and what prices would you charge at the front gate and pit gate? I would change nothing

Question 7: What classes would you run and do you need anything different like school bus races, boat races, etc ... to draw fans in? Our track has a great selection of classes

Question 8: If two tracks with similiar classes were running friday night, four on Saturday night, one on Sunday night, and none on any other night of the week - which night would you think that you could be most successful? Friday

[SLMAngel]

Question 1: First name, state, and whether you are a promoter, track employee, car owner, driver, crew, or fan

Elizabeth, VA, crew

Question 2: In your opinion - is your local track(s) struggling to draw fans, cars, or both?

Both

Question 3: In response to question 2 - why do you think that is?

The level of competition is what I believe keeps the cars away, on a given night if there are 10 cars in a class, 8 of them are capable of winning.

As for the fans, I would venture to guess the economy has alot to do with it, but to see a good show with a good purse, you're going to have to pay for it.

Question 4: What is your tracks top class? Super Late Models, 410 Sprints, Modifieds, IMCA style Mods, etc ...

Super Late Models

Question 5: $8 Tickets and $15 pit passes means you might see $700 to win for the top class ... Do you think Supers, 410's, Modifieds, and Late Model Stock Cars could afford to race for that?

No

Question 6: What is fair to pay your top class to win/start and what prices would you charge at the front gate and pit gate?

At least $2000
Front Gate $12 to $20 depending on the payout for the top class a $2000 show $12, a $4000 show $15 and so on

Pit Gate $25 to $30 unless it's a really big show

Question 7: What classes would you run and do you need anything different like school bus races, boat races, etc ... to draw fans in?

Some type of Limited or Crate Late Model Class, Super Street, Pure Stock V8, and a 4 Cylinder class of sometype and bring in Super late Models for big shows during the season

And finally ... Question 8: If two tracks with similiar classes were running friday night, four on Saturday night, one on Sunday night, and none on any other night of the week - which night would you think that you could be most successful?

Saturday

I appreciate everyones efforts in answering these questions ... The column will appear in RPM Racing News in the next week or so and I wil post here as well.

Mark[/quote]

[SevenL]

Question 1: First name, state, and whether you are a promoter, track employee, car owner, driver, crew, or fan

Randy, NC, owner/driver

Question 2: In your opinion - is your local track(s) struggling to draw fans, cars, or both?

fans primarily, cars less so

Question 3: In response to question 2 - why do you think that is?

It is my observation that track owners/promoters depend on the racers to bring the fans and the show. Local racers spend all their time and money keeping their cars ready to race. Not only that, but purses are largely lower than they were 20 years ago (not even counting inflation). It appears that the owners/promoters expect sponsors to cover the racer's operating cost (thus the low purses). Combining a lack of aggressive promotion with poor purses explains a lot about the current situation.

Question 4: What is your tracks top class? Super Late Models, 410 Sprints, Modifieds, IMCA style Mods, etc ...

SLM

Question 5: $8 Tickets and $15 pit passes means you might see $700 to win for the top class ... Do you think Supers, 410's, Modifieds, and Late Model Stock Cars could afford to race for that?

The problem with purses is the winner-take-all mentality. If you start at $700 and decrease by $50 per position you would probably get a good field of cars for most any division. If, however, your pay-out looks like: 700, 500, 300, 200, 100, 50, 40, 30, 20, 10, etc. you probably aren't going to see large fields of cars for any division.

Question 6: What is fair to pay your top class to win/start and what prices would you charge at the front gate and pit gate?

Again, the issue for racer support is down-the-line payout. Since it costs about $100 in fuel to get to and from the track and run a SLM for 40 laps, the starting pay-off has got to meet that amount (over and above entry-fee).

Question 7: What classes would you run and do you need anything different like school bus races, boat races, etc ... to draw fans in?

Specialty events are helpful. However, the problem that this creates with the fans and racers is the length of time spent at the track. It is important to finish the show before mid-night to attract new fans. Dropping a class each time a specialty event is added would help on that score.

And finally ... Question 8: If two tracks with similiar classes were running friday night, four on Saturday night, one on Sunday night, and none on any other night of the week - which night would you think that you could be most successful?

Success depends on the competition, so the Saturday event would produce best finishes. However, I prefer to race Friday nights.

[thunderbird]

hi HAROLD from Wooster ohio i think the tracks should drop the grandstand to 10 andthe pits to 20 and put aclaim on the purestocks of 2500.00 and one on the minniestock.

[Talley]

Question 1: First name, state, and whether you are a promoter, track employee, car owner, driver, crew, or fan
Dick Talley,Maryland,owner/driver #305 Sprint car in Virginia Sprint Series

Question 2: In your opinion - is your local track(s) struggling to draw fans, cars, or both?
We race at various tracks in Va, West VA and NC. Local tracks all seem to be declining in attentance and car counts. Some more than others. Several tracks have been sold in our area this year.

Question 3: In response to question 2 - why do you think that is?
Nascar has schedule more Sat night races,
I dont see very much advertising for races
gas prices being up
some of the tracks need to get more focused on 'the show' ie. run a smoother show on time, less down time, get programs in the stands with info about the the drivers point standings bio's about the drivers and teams
watching a race where you dont know the drivers is no where as interestings as if you have a name and face to put to the car.
Question 4: What is your tracks top class? Super Late Models, 410 Sprints, Modifieds, IMCA style Mods, etc ...
We race at various tracks but in Va the top class is super late or limited late models. The best races however are usally the street stocks. Of course the VSS does put on a very organized show and makes an extreme effort to be timily and provide a clean race.

Question 5: $8 Tickets and $15 pit passes means you might see $700 to win for the top class ... Do you think Supers, 410's, Modifieds, and Late Model Stock Cars could afford to race for that?
The cost of fielding a competive race car is out of hand in most cases. The basic competitivness of racers to win is a driving force that will and does cause the cost to contiune to esculate. This can only be controled by strict rules that prevent competitors from buying an advantage.
The VSS RACESAVER is effectively doing this
Competition Objectives:
This is recreational racing. Cost containment is our primary objective. Respect, for competitors, fans, and promoters, is fundamental to our success. We will do what is necessary to produce a good competitive show each night. We will not tolerate overtly aggressive driving. The willingness to give racing room is a defining aspect of RACESAVER® 305 SPEC races. (see VSSweb site for details.)


Question 6: What is fair to pay your top class to win/start and what prices would you charge at the front gate and pit gate?
I think this could vary widely based on the quality of the show and location. the track owner needs to market research this. To establish a weekly fan base is much more important than the occasional fan. This must be promoted by as many means as possible ie kids nights , bike races, get the fans in the pits and promote the driver interaction with the fans....VSS throws frisbries in the stands with car drivers names and numbers on them, get the winning cars frisbree and you win a goody package. The more you can entertain the more you can charge. Keep the action going! What you pay the drivers has to leave the track ower/promoter a margin of profit. Flatter purses will keep the car count up. Disiplining the recklessness of driving will also in the long run as the competitors dont have to spends as much on repairs


Question 7: What classes would you run and do you need anything different like school bus races, boat races, etc ... to draw fans in?
Partly answered above, I think having Sprint cars, late models and street stock class give a good varity of races. Any 'special night' races can be a real beneifit if promoted properly. Charity races with local celeberities with alot of advertising in local paper. Get the little league coaches or local teachers to drive a 5 lap hobby stock shoot out for a local charity. ...new fans?

And finally ... Question 8: If two tracks with similiar classes were running friday night, four on Saturday night, one on Sunday night, and none on any other night of the week - which night would you think that you could be most successful?

The one who put on the best show with the best advertising would be the most seccussful. A good announcer with a good sound system is important. Sunday night is a big disadvantage though. And Late night shows also have a dis-advantage. I have seen one of the most sucessfull fan wise go kart tracks runs on Tuesday night. short show, fast moving, good announcer


Hope this helps you. Please do look into the racesaver concept. I am able to race a full size sprint car everyweek on a working mans salary. Best racing in my life.

Dick Talley

[RaceJunkie]

I want to thank everyone for the input we have so far. Please encourage your friends to give their input as well. As we all know everyone has a different opinion.:lrc_rules:

[RaceNite]

Great responses - keep em coming - Column will be in the Challenger Issue of RMP Racing News - Oct 13

[Racerchaser]

#1 Lower/Slower Delaware
#2 For sure at D.I.S., Georgetown seems to be doing good.
#3 At D.I.S. shows they are to drawn out, long intermissions, regrade track and groom it for 45 mins. or longer, Plus to many support classes. Georgetown seems to keep the show moving. They run 4 classes.
#4 Both tracks Big Block Modifieds and Super Late Models.
#5 No way
#6 Big Block Modifieds could race for $2250.00 and Super Late Models $2000.00 with a $200.00 to take the green in both classes. General addmission no more then $12.00 for regular night, $15.00 for special shows. Pits $20.00/$25.00
#7 Big Block Modifieds, Super Late Models, Crate Mods, Crate Late Models.
#8 They run Friday for Georgetown and Saturday for D.I.S. which is good.

[RaceJunkie]

Sent byemail.

inglefamilyracin
I tried to answer this from your web page but kept getting a message from
Microsoft about page. I did print out ?'s so I can answer them here.

1. Vera, NC, car owner, IFR,Inc.

2. We ran at Ace Speedway this year instead of Caraway due in large part to
problems with NOT being able to get enough sponsors. Ace has 2 tire rule change while Caraway is 4 tires. Our car #97, with Jesse Ingle lll as driver, won the Limited Late Model Championship as well as Rookie of the Year in LLM last year. I think both places are seeing tough times now, possibly economy(GAS).

3. At Ace last year as well as this year, rain-outs have hurt. They cut out Super Stocks last year after five races due to lack of cars to compete. #97 had won 3 of the 5 before the cut, we stayed at Caraway even though it's about forty five minutes away, Ace is only ten.

4. At both tracks the top weekly class is Late Models. They also run Modifieds. Caraway has Friday & Saturday races, also truck races.

5. Ace is $10 per race, unless there is a Hooter's or some other special competion.
Caraway is $12 per race and $20 for specials. Pit passes at both places have gone up in the three years IFR,Inc. has been in racing. Ace just doubled their top $ after the new owners came onboard. This brought back some of the competition they had lost to Orange County, as well as more people in the stands. We really don't like having the spotter away from trackside, Ace now has them in front of the grandstrand, we are a small organization, our spotter just happens to know more about our car than anyone else, wrecks that happen cause havoc if you don't have the main guy down there working our small crew to repair things. Ace was not even at the level for winning you mentioned until the new owners took over. If you love racing, you will afford it somehow.

6.Ace is 10/25, Caraway was 12/30 last year, not sure about this year. I think this
is about the limit on what folks around here will spend. I think $800 to win would be a good starting point for the top class,more would be better, but it does take $ to operate a good track.

7. We will again be in Late Model Stock Car next year. Ace has bicycle races for the kids 2-3 times per year. They also have the chain car races. Caraway has their Fastor Pastor races each year. All of these seem to help draw folks in as well as having special $5 nights, Ladies night. Don't think buses, boats would draw in folks here that much. Both places run into problems when High School Football starts in late August. What seems to hurt Ace the most has been the rainouts.

8. Last year we ran Ace on Friday night in Super Stock, changed the setup and ran Limited Late models at Caraway on Saturday nights until Ace dropped theSuper Stock. Personally I think Ace would do better if they ran on Saturday nights instead of Friday. They only run one night.

[thegarbaby]

Many local race tracks are suffering with fan counts at an all time low. The southeast is reportedly suffering and that could be because so many tracks are located so close to each other. The same can be said for the northeast!

But what about the midwest? The south? The southwest and northwest? Are tracks out there feeling the pinch?

Promoters have laid blame on high gas prices, poor economy, and the fact that ticket prices have to be high so they can afford to pay a high purse to the top division(s).

RPM's Stewart Doty said in this month's newsletter that it is time that race tracks "get back to the $8 tickets, $15 pit passes, modest purses, and economy, locally based racing ..."

This is where I need your help! I am writing a new column and you can help by answering a few questions in my little survey.

Question 1: First name, state, and whether you are a promoter, track employee, car owner, driver, crew, or fan

Question 2: In your opinion - is your local track(s) struggling to draw fans, cars, or both?

Question 3: In response to question 2 - why do you think that is?

Question 4: What is your tracks top class? Super Late Models, 410 Sprints, Modifieds, IMCA style Mods, etc ...

Question 5: $8 Tickets and $15 pit passes means you might see $700 to win for the top class ... Do you think Supers, 410's, Modifieds, and Late Model Stock Cars could afford to race for that?

Question 6: What is fair to pay your top class to win/start and what prices would you charge at the front gate and pit gate?

Question 7: What classes would you run and do you need anything different like school bus races, boat races, etc ... to draw fans in?

And finally ... Question 8: If two tracks with similiar classes were running friday night, four on Saturday night, one on Sunday night, and none on any other night of the week - which night would you think that you could be most successful?

I appreciate everyones efforts in answering these questions ... The column will appear in RPM Racing News in the next week or so and I wil post here as well.

Mark

1. Garland, NC and Fan.

2. Yes.

3. Poor track prep, No weekly Late models at most tracks, poor purses, entertainment competition is greater today. Track owners do not put money back into their facilities.

4. Limited Late models or Crates on dirt, Late model Stock on asphalt.

5. No.

6. 2,500 to win, 200 to start. Admission 12 to 15$

7. Dirt: Super Late Models, Crates, open Wheeled Modified, Superstock 8, Superstock 4. Personally I don't care for demo derbies and gimmick races but I believe they are necessary to draw in non hardcore fans.

8. One of the two on Friday night.

[jbal59]

Question 1: First name, state, and whether you are a promoter, track employee, car owner, driver, crew, or fan

Jeff, VA, fan

Question 2: In your opinion - is your local track(s) struggling to draw fans, cars, or both?

Yes, Change in ownership

Question 3: In response to question 2 - why do you think that is?

Too many classes, Inconsistent Rules, Lack of promotion, Could charge more.

Question 4: What is your tracks top class? Super Late Models, 410 Sprints, Modifieds, IMCA style Mods, etc ...

Super Late, Sprint

Question 5: $8 Tickets and $15 pit passes means you might see $700 to win for the top class ... Do you think Supers, 410's, Modifieds, and Late Model Stock Cars could afford to race for that?

I would pay more

Question 6: What is fair to pay your top class to win/start and what prices would you charge at the front gate and pit gate?

Up to $20 gate

Question 7: What classes would you run and do you need anything different like school bus races, boat races, etc ... to draw fans in?

Fewer classes with more per class. No special events

[RaceJunkie]

Sent in by
Stan Lester
Fastrak Racing Series



Many local race tracks are suffering with fan counts at an all time low. The
southeast is reportedly suffering and that could be because so many tracks
are located so close to each other. The same can be said for the northeast!

But what about the midwest? The south? The southwest and northwest? Are
tracks out there feeling the pinch?

Tracks are feeling the pinch across the entire Nation.

Promoters have laid blame on high gas prices, poor economy, and the fact
that ticket prices have to be high so they can afford to pay a high purse to
the top division(s).

RPM's Stewart Doty said in this month's newsletter that it is time that race
tracks "get back to the $8 tickets, $15 pit passes, modest purses, and
economy, locally based racing ..."

This is where I need your help! I am writing a new column and you can help
by answering a few questions in my little survey.

Question 1: First name, state, and whether you are a promoter, track
employee, car owner, driver, crew, or fan

Stan Lester: Georgia. Tracks in SD,OR,VA,TN,KY,IL,MO.SC,NC, WI and AL.

Question 2: In your opinion - is your local track(s) struggling to draw
fans, cars, or both?

Fans for the most part. IN some cases its cars but that seems to be more
limited to tracks that have suffered past problems with owners and so forth.



Question 3: In response to question 2 - why do you think that is?

The game has changed. People have lots of other options now. When I was
younger going to a race was a big thing, now its just something else to do.
We are losing out young base of customers. Our customer base has gotten
older and we have not done things to bringing in new fans.

Question 4: What is your tracks top class? Super Late Models, 410 Sprints,
Modifieds, IMCA style Mods, etc ...

Fastrak runs Late Models and Open Wheel Modifeds.

Question 5: $8 Tickets and $15 pit passes means you might see $700 to win
for the top class ... Do you think Supers, 410's, Modifieds, and Late Model
Stock Cars could afford to race for that?

That's a big dilemma. Would it bring in more fans? Maybe. $700 to win for
Super Late Models would be tough to do. If a engine cost $35,000 and they
have to run for $700 I am not sure how many people could or would do that.

Question 6: What is fair to pay your top class to win/start and what prices
would you charge at the front gate and pit gate?

Put it this way. If you have a $35,000 engine in a Super and calculated 10%
of your engine cost for first place that would be $3500 to win every week.
No track can do that. That's tough. Now the crate engine late models on the
other hand have a $5000 engine and that being the case 10% of that is $500
to win. That's doesn't really answer the question but economics sort of take
over in this aspect. I wished I had the answer to big dollar engines.
Personally I think paying "thicker" through the field helps a lot. There is
only one winner and 23 that didn't win. It cost those teams just as much to
get there. Not to mention even the "big dogs" have a bad night now and again
and the extra dollars to start help them too.

Question 7: What classes would you run and do you need anything different
like school bus races, boat races, etc ... to draw fans in?

Specials should make a track money. That should be what they are for. Maybe
all they do is break even in the beginning but as that date is set for that
class every year then it begins to grown and prosper. If the racing is good
then it continues to draw fans and cars. The money aspect to teams is
important but the prestige of a special event can also be very important. It
seems you have to do some different things now to draw "additional" fans.
Like we do the truck and Harleys giveaways now. One drawing for a fan and
one for a driver. It works.

And finally ... Question 8: If two tracks with similiar classes were running
friday night, four on Saturday night, one on Sunday night, and none on any
other night of the week - which night would you think that you could be most
successful?

I don't think there is any doubt that Saturday night is still the answer to
short track racing. We have run events in the middle of the week and done
well but that was in the Mid West. It seems to be more acceptable there.

I appreciate everyones efforts in answering these questions ... The column
will appear in RPM Racing News in the next week or so and I wil post here as
well.

***********************************************
I tell you the tracks have got to clean their acts up. Bathrooms and that sort of thing I think is a bigger hindrance to new customers. I can remember looking at a track owner and asking him, would you let your wife go in there? I actually bought a trailer with a bath in it just so the ladies on our crew could utilize it. I know updating bathrooms is expensive but that’s cheaper than going broke and out of business.



Real estate is another issue. Real estate has gotten pretty pricey and some owners are selling. You can’t blame them. Insurance is high now. Lots of things but if you look around the nicer tracks seem to be doing ok and the tracks with run down facilities seem to be doing worse for the most part. There are some exceptions but I really think they are exceptions to the rule.



Gas prices did hurt a ton this year. People lost their “disposable” income or either they had to spend it just getting back and forth to work. We have a snack business that is 30 years old and sales were off 73% during the summer when gas prices were high. Just think that’s a business that is 30 years old. People didn’t have the extra income to go in and buy a coke and a candy bar. They just left without it. The economy out here in the real world is still tough. Plants still closing, people losing jobs and the jobs are not being replaced for the most part. Regardless of what the news says.



Tracks need to advertise. They just stopped for some reason. Ss business got worse tracks tightened their advertising budget when in fact they should have been increasing that budget. I can’t tell you how many times this year with things as simple as flyers and posters. We would send them out in a pr package and they wouldn’t even put them up or hand them out. It was pretty confusing really. You can’t complain about things being bad if you aren’t willing to get out there and use the tools given to you.



God Bless;



Stan Lester

[w1ck3d0n3l0st]

hey junkie where is your answer's to this

[purplerose22603]

Question 1: First name, state, and whether you are a promoter, track employee, car owner, driver, crew, or fan

Erica Miller, Winchester, VA, wife of driver, Mitch Miller #95

Question 2: In your opinion - is your local track(s) struggling to draw fans, cars, or both?

We have a good car count at our track and a pretty good attendance of fans too.

Question 3: In response to question 2 - why do you think that is?

It is reasonably priced!

Question 4: What is your tracks top class? Super Late Models, 410 Sprints, Modifieds, IMCA style Mods, etc ...

Late Models

Question 5: $8 Tickets and $15 pit passes means you might see $700 to win for the top class ... Do you think Supers, 410's, Modifieds, and Late Model Stock Cars could afford to race for that?

Yes.

Question 6: What is fair to pay your top class to win/start and what prices would you charge at the front gate and pit gate?

Not sure on pay outs. Winchester charges $10 stands and $20 pits for regular races. Big races are more.

Question 7: What classes would you run and do you need anything different like school bus races, boat races, etc ... to draw fans in?

I think that our track has a good class standing with 4 classes and the occasional special class that comes to the track.

And finally ... Question 8: If two tracks with similiar classes were running friday night, four on Saturday night, one on Sunday night, and none on any other night of the week - which night would you think that you could be most successful?

I think it comes down to loyalty to a track and management.

[gofastturnleft]

Admin performing user test :DontKnow:


---------------------

Dwayne

[RaceJunkie]

Admin performing user test :DontKnow:


---------------------

Dwayne

The above user said they had a problem posting in this thread. So I basicly reset their password logged in as them and made the above post. a soon as they see that there is nothing wrong with the board I will remove it..:wings_yes:

[RaceNite]

Thanks for all of the replys ... column is in the process of being written!