Your opinion wanted

[drslam31]

Well The junkyard class at Wake County Speedway didn't get off the ground like exspected.I heard rumors of change for 2007 with this class so being me I came up with what I thought would be great for the fans and want opinions from drivers and fans alike before I submit this.

1.Any car (4cyl,v6,v8,etc)
2. Any size motor as long as it came in that make,model
3. Car must remain stock except safety modifications (seat,belts,roll cage,fuel cell)
4.Class will run EVERY week with a points champion determined at seasons end
5. first race of 2007 will pay $1000 if 15 or more cars show.If not payout will be determined by number of cars that show. this will occur 2 more times during the season (the midpoint, and seasons final race). All other races will pay a set amount no matter how many cars show.
6. Class will have a claim rule where any car finishing in the top X can purchase the winning car for $X and trade cars.Safety additions may be removed from each car if desired.

Would this class be successful? why,why not? also should roll cages be mandatory? Thanks! this is just from my warped mind so add anything you think would make it better.

[TROUBLE]

NOPE!

Reason being - that mr x can go out and spend $10,000 to build a winning car and mr y will go out and spend $50 on some looser and at the end of the night the whole purpose of mr y being there is to buy mr x's car.

If I am going to go out and buy a chassis and build a roll cage and build a motor so it will last all season and buy good wheels and tires and spend money to make a compeditive racecar. Do you think that after one night of racing that I am going to be willing to give my car away to some looser with a 1980 Chevette with swingset rollbar tubing in it. Do you think that I am going to be willing to come back next week with that Chevette that will probably blow up in the heat race? Hell No!

Here is a better option:

You get a man such as me to build 20 cars. Each car is as compeditive as the next. Such as the IROC cars you see on TV. Then each man pays a $10,000 buy in. That is insurance money that he isn't going to go out and tear his car up everyweek. If you tear people up = they throw you out of the series and they keep the $10,000.

I build you 20 cars = all with V - 8 engines, new 10" wheels, new 28.5 x 11.00 x 15 tires, all new roll cage materials. All new Kirkey seats, all new steering wheels and seat belts, the same gear ratio's in all cars. The same transmissions in all cars. The same size engines built to the same specifications with a SBC 350 and 4bbl Quadrajet carb. Headers, and all the bells and whistles. Put a MSD 6 AL box on the car with a 6500 RPM chip in the box.

At the begining of the night, all of the 20 people that wish to race that night goes out in front of the crowd and draws a pill. Numbered 1 - 20. If there is more than 20 people - then there is alternate numbers. You could possibly run 2 races a night in that division. Then they have a BINGO type draw where they pull out the number for your car for that night by the number that you drew in the pill drawing.

You put decals similiar to NASCAR style decals on all the cars. So say the Number 1 - might be the ONO car that Donnie Allison drove in the 70's. The Number 2 car would look like the Rusty Wallace car, the number 3 car would be black and have Goodwrench decals on it - and so forth. That would make people want to go out on the track and race one of them cars for a night.

Their next step would be to buy gasoline. 10 Gallons at $5.00 a Gallon.
That is enough fuel to get anyone through the night.

4 heat races with 5 cars in each heat race. 15 cars in the feature.
If more than one set of drivers compete = the slowest cars go to a consi race. Every driver pays $50 a night to get in the pits for this division.

Winner gets - $500.00 Heat race winner get's $50.00
Nobody leaves with less than $25.00
Let the track figure out how to pay 2nd through 15th'.

Make the rules so no one that has won a division title elsewhere can race. Make it so no Late Model Drivers can compete in this division.

I know you are going to cry about the $10,000 up front money. But what can you buy now a days for $10,000.00

Where can you go race Street Stocks for $100 a night and not have to work on the car all week?

[drslam31]

Sounds like a great idea for someone,but the problem is most drivers in the Junkyard class don't spend $5000 on the car for the entire season.You could purchase the car that won the last race in the 4 cyl class at my track for $6500 with many extra parts. The junkyard class was designed for low budget drivers not drivers with $10,000 to blow.If the car must remain stock where are you blowing your $10,000? what type of plugs you buying?

[TROUBLE]

If you are talking about a V 8 class that pays anything then you are most definately going to have $4500 + into a motor. Then you might be able to build a decent chassis for another $6500.00

4 Cylinder classes never get the respect that they deserve. Knowing that - you cannot race a $100 car for $500 to win. No track is going to pay you a decent amount of money as soon as you tell them 4 cylinders.

It all boils down to what are you willing to spend and how much do you expect out of it. The $10,000 is the deposit. You don't own it. But if you tear it up = you bought it.

You just can't race for less than a couple of hundred dollars a week with a street stock. The tires cost that much!

[drslam31]

I guess nobody else wants to weigh in on this.Thanks for your input trouble.

[TROUBLE]

Can I ask you a personal question. What do you get out of 4 cylinder racing.

I talked to a young man a few weeks ago that has been racing the same car in the same series for 3 years now. That night his car got tore up and his father was mad. Now anyone that raced the same car - without doing much of anything to it in my opinion is pretty lucky.

He said that he even made a few dollars racing - which is hard to believe since he races in a class where you pay $20 to get in the pits and only pays $50 to win.

Nothing you do to a front wheel drive 4 cylinder translates to the bigger cars. They don't steer the same and they don't handle the same.
I understand that it is fun to be out on the track like the big boys- but since I am a very goal oriented person - it is hard for me to understand why anyone would want to spend $200 a week to win $50!

Let alone build a safe car and then have someone else claim it at the end of the night.

[drslam31]

I can't answer that.I have never been in a 4 cyl race car and really don't want to be in one.I wanna race a v-8,but currently I'm unable to afford to run the limited late model or late model class at my track so I'm looking to start at the bottom and work my way up slowly.I drove a fwd,v6 in two races and agree they handle nothing like a v8 would.My hope is the track will have a stock v8 class in 07,but I doubt it will happen.

[TROUBLE]

You're best bet is to save your money and wait till the circumstances are right for you to race. The stands are full of people that used to race.
They didn't quit because they wern't good enough. They quit because it cost too much and took up too much time.

Only one time in 10,000 will someone that starts out at the bottom get the opportunity to move up and drive for someone else. Even then - most people never appreciate what other people are doing for them and they usually end up messing up the deal.

So if you read what I origionally posted - you will see if a person has $10,000 to loose to race - then he can afford to race. If he is living hand to mouth and can barely make ends meet. Then his best option is to sit in the stands and watch the races.

Driving a Late Model or a Limited Late Model is more than just the purchase price of the racecar. It is mantience and upkeep and getting it to and from the track and working on it all week - just to go out on the track for 20 minutes and tear it up again. Leave them divisions to people that were born with silver spoons in their mouths and keep it more down to earth.

A boy I know that drives a Super Stock works summers, nights and weekends at a lawn mower repair shop. Probably makes a little more than mininum wage. His father works as a truck driver for a local grocery store chain and also owns a race shop that sells parts for TC Racecars. They sell fuel and parts at the locak tracks and his mother runs the family buisness. His father blows up once or twice a year because he cannot afford to buy a race engine and he builds stock block engines that don't hold up for very long.

The father only raced 3 times this year before his car blew up and he had to park it for the year.

The boy has a car that his father and uncles built for him and a engine that his father built for him and he is compeditive every week. At the end of last year - which was his first year in a racecar. He told me that he wanted to build a new racecar for next year. I told him that he has a good racecar and he should spend the money he would have spent building a new one to improve his old one. I believe that he won 3 races at two different tracks this year.

The Late Model didn't cost much more than the Super Stock.. The boy makes maybe $200 a week and the father makes $800 a week and the boy can race and the father can't. You have to have priorities when you race and you have to learn to live on a budget. When your budget is spent - you have to be willing to park it and sit in the stands.

[Team420]

I would have to disagree. Almost everyone wants to drive a race car. Why not have just straight up stock, from the factory race car for the real low budget teams? No one ever said that you had to go out and spend 5,000 on a car. How much you put in to a car is up to you, just know that at the end of the nite your car can be bought for say 1500. Why would anyone want to put more than 500-1000 in a car that can be bought for 1500? All the rules would be the same for each car and for everyone out there that wanted to race in this class. Everything would have to be STOCK. This means.............NO RACE ENGINES, NO RACING TIRES, NO RACING FUEL, NO RACING SUSPENSION PARTS, ETC... Everything must be stock and match the make of the car from the top to bottom, front to rear. Everything stock, the only modifications that you would be allowed would be removal of the interior to make room for a partial roll cage and a racing seat and belts and all glass must be romoved except for the windshield, all trim and lights removed etc. All that is the only thing that would be mandatory. A really low budget race car. That would be the goal. Why should ex-race car drivers be punished for not being able to afford to go racing? THEY SHOULDNT BE! The purse wouldnt have to be an arm and a leg. Say they run for 100-200 to win, and 25 to get the car and driver in to the race track. That might be enough to get the attention to all the ones that would like to race but cant afford to. If you want to go faster or whatever, then spend to 10,000 or whatever have ya and build you a car and jump into it with all the big boys and see just how long you can last out there. I honestly believe that if someone around here where to run a division such as this, I think it would have lots of participation and good car counts and possibly bring in more spectators as well, thus generating more money for the track and area businesses as well. EVERYONE DESERVES A CHANCE!!!:smoke:

[drslam31]

team420 your looking at this more in the way I was hoping.Your saying exactly what I was talking about.Let's put the trophy in the hands of the guy with the most talent, not the biggest wallet,but 420 you didn't weigh in o nwhether you think my idea would work or what would need to be modified with it to work.

[Team420]

I believe that it would work. Maybe let it only be a 4 cylinder and 6 cylinder class, all stock, meanin that everything that came on it from the factory be in place, minus the ac or the cat. convertor, everything else must be there. Low budget = low budget! Spend no more than 1000, however that is up to you, and your can be bought as is, just like it came off the track minus the driver, nothing else. Everything else must remain on the car. If you refuse to sell your car, you are docked 50 points and forefit all your winnings and points for the nite and after say the third time of refusing, maybe have them pay a 500 fine and be suspended for 2 weeks. With all that in place, it should make for very competitive class and maybe help someone land a ride in another division or what have ya.

[JRhodes]

I think it would work, but there would have to be a lot of policing going on. It's kind of like the dirt crate models, if you were caught cheating, you should recieve a year suspension. If it's a factory stock class, it needs to remain factory stock, except for the items you said like roll cage, fuel cell, etc. As far as the claim rule, I would say that only the winner's car could be claimed by the 2nd place finisher. I say let any and all cars run, FWD, RWD, AWD, 4cyl, 6cyl, 8cyl..AS LONG AS THEY REMAIN STOCK!

[drslam31]

Thanks guys for the input and keep it comming.

[Team420]

Im not so sure letting an all wheel drive car compete with the front wheel and rear wheel drives as that would be an unfair disadvantage to the ones that are not running an all wheel drive. If someone where to start a class such as this, I think lettin the V6's and the 4 cylinders would be a kool idea as most 4 cylinders can produce a little more power in some cases than a V6. If there was such a class, I think I would put the V8's in a class of there own. All in all, I think it would make for a competitive class and a fun one to watch as well.

[JRhodes]

I think lettin the V6's and the 4 cylinders would be a kool idea as most 4 cylinders can produce a little more power in some cases than a V6. If there was such a class, I think I would put the V8's in a class of there own.

I agree with that!

For that fact, I would like to see a six cylinder racecar division started up somewhere.

[Redclay Rebel]

Jerry Jones told us at one point he has less than $1000 in the #73 junkyard(bomber) car and he won almost every week at Clarys.

[shotgun]

How did he do that I thought at Clarys they run the same thang as super street cars like at the line. well dont know too much bout asphalt cars but to me aphalt is too expensive period for me to race. Yall are sayin at Wake County ps4 only make 50 for winnin well at County Line we make 150 or more for winnin.

[TROUBLE]

Somebody somewhere here missed the point. You want a 4 cylinder class - which most tracks already have. Then you want it to be affordable - which nothing in racing is cheap.

I will put it this way. A person I know has all the money in the world. His family owns a fuel distribution company in the middle of coal country. They probably own 200 delivery trucks. They probably have storage facilities for 80,000 gallons of fuel that they can deliver in a single day.

They already own a Late Model and they employ a shop for the sole purpose of seting up. preparing and pitting their racecar. They race all over the East Coast at Specials and also at some local tracks such as Lernerville.

3 of his family members wanted to race Front Wheel Drive 4 cylinders. So they went out and bought 6 cars and took them to a local fab shop. The man that owns the fab shop builds Super Late Models, Late Models, Semi Late Models, Street Stocks.

His price for a Late Model frame is about $6500.00

His price for a Street Stock is about $6500 - and you supply the GM metric frame.

His price for a Front Wheel Drive 4 Cylinder is about $1500 and you supply the gutted out car.

All he does is install the bars and make the chassis safe to race in.

It might take as little as a day or as much as a week to complete depending on how good you want the car to be.

Now here was people with money to burn. They built the cars and raced one year and at the end of the year they either quit or moved up a division or two. Most all the cars they hauled to the scrap yard. There was nothing left.

The division attracted about 40 cars a night and the track promoters all paid $50 to win. Some ran one feature and others ran a consi. Everyone paid $20 a night to get in the pits. Driver, pit crew etc. So if a average man takes 2 buddies along with them. They already paid $60 just to get in.

Second place paid $25 and 3rd paid $10

The rest got $5 tow money.

A front wheel drive 4 cylinder is not a racecar. The chassis components are not strong enough to stand up to a rutted race track. Everything on them cars bends and breaks. The engines has to be ran in 1st or 2nd gear. It takes a lot of Rpm's to keep your momentum up on a tacky race track.

The people that win - buy's a Neon with the single over head cam engine. They build a header type exhaust with trumpet style exits. They take the transmission to a shop and have the 2nd gear changed in the transmission.
They get someone with a power tuner to turn the computer up as far as it will go for performance and some I believe gets over sized injectors.
There is rumors that more than one team sent their heads to California to be ported and polished and port matched and bowl blended.

Rumor is that one of them engines Dyno'd over 400 Hp at the Flywheel.

Then you add in all the Titanium parts in the engine and driveline. The price of Cv's / Axles that will handle all the stress and a set of racing struts. A fuel cell and a seat and some gauges and they spent just shy of $10,000

The people that owned the fuel distribution spent the $1500 for the cage and what ever for the car and couldn't understand how they were getting beat night after night.

No matter how simple you make the rules. There is always someone that is going to bend / break them rules just to make themselves look like big shots.

One of the local dirt tracks that started this division made a rule this year that you can buy the other persons car for your car and $1500 as long as you finish on the same lap. None of the high dollar spenders came back.

Actually I would like to see everyone have a racecar - because I want you just as poor as I am. You will all be eating Velveeta Cheese sandwiches in the parking lot and drinking spring water from a Clorox jug.

[KENTNJUDY02]

Front Wheel Drve Is Ok. Ask Jerry Jones. For Most Of The Season His Biggest Chalange Was 4 Cyl Front Wheel Drive. He Runs V8.i Finished 2nd To Him One Night And I Was Plesed.i Have Also Seen Him Get Out Run By A 4 Cyl. Jerry Is A Good Driver. I Have Drove Fwd Honda And Fwd Ford Probe.